Machiavelli and What Makes a Great Leader

What does Machiavelli argue makes a great leader? On the island, who do you think would make the best leader? Why?

In The Princeby Machiavelli, Machiavelli argues that a great leader is someone who ignites a healthy, respectful fear in his people to maintain order, but avoids their hatred by not displaying unnecessary cruel behaviors. On the island in Lord of the Flies, I think that the best leader will end up being Jack because his forward behavior will ignite a respectful fear among the boys and maintain order, but he also is very organized and civilized and believes that the boys "have got to have rules and obey them" (42, Goulding). Between his very forward, no-nonsense nature and his care for organization and rules, I believe that Jack would make the best leader on the island.

Machiavelli argues that a strong leader is made up of a couple of attributes. Leaders that are song and powerfull with their words were more likely to stay in power. Also leaders who insight fear into their followers were more likely to succeed in power. In lord of the flies jack would probably be the best leader because he is aggressive and powerful with his words. He and Ralph were the only ones to try and steput up to the plate when it came to leading. No one in lord of the flies insights fear into the children because they are all scared of what had just happened to them.

Machiavelli argues that "a prince ought to inspire fear in such a way that, if he does not win love, he avoids hatred; because he can endure very well being feared whilst he is not hated." He says that in order to be feared but not hated, the leader must not infringe on the property of his subjects. I think that Ralph would be and is the best leader in [i]Lord of the Flies[i] because he is the one who takes the initiative to climb the mountain to scout the island, build a fire, and construct shelters.

Machiavelli believes that in order to be a great leader you must take many precautions. One quality a leader should have is the ability to get away from distractions, and use mistakes as an advantage.  Machiavelli states "...to keep himself, if t be possible, from those which would not lose him it; but, this not being possible, he may with less hesitation abandon himself to them" (Machiavelli 72). What he says in order to be a great leader the person needs to stay to themselves, and if that is not possible abandon the people so they can stay to themselves. This is why Piggy, from Lord of the Flies would make a great leader.  He seems to always be by himself observing the surroundings, which helps him to make better decisions for the good of the group. Since Piggy is always alone he does not have anyone distracting him. It was Piggy's idea to use the conch Ralph found to call the rest of the boys on the island, Piggy says "'Ralph!... We can use this to call the others. Have a meeting. They'll come when they hear us'" (Golding 16). Piggy also stated he knew conchs could make horn like noises by blowing into them from a past memory. He uses is experiences for smart ideas and decision making.

Machiavelli believes that a good leader respects the citizens' rights and property, acts in the best interest of the people, but is not afraid punish people who step out of line. In Lord of the Flies, I believe the best leader would be Piggy. He cares the most about the group, knows what needs to be accomplished, and is not afraid to keep troublemakers in check, as shown by when he yells at Ralph and Jack for not caring enough.

A leader must know of the true nature of mankind. There is a always a selfish and evil desire in every person that causes empires to collapse. The leader must exercise acts of the good and kindness, but also a firm, unwavering stance of his or her decisions. The decisions must be thoughtful of every consequence. The prince must "know how to avoid the reproach of those vices which would lose him his state" Machiavelli). People must be a stalwart factor in the stability of the government, so the leader must know his or her limits to avoid rebellion.

What does Machiavelli argue makes a great leader? On the island, who do you think would make the best leader? Why?

Machiavelli argues a great leader should be "considered clement and not cruel" (Machiavelli 1), feared rather than loved, but not hated. He states, "men lov[e] according to their own will and fearing according to that of the prince, a wise prince should establish himself on that which is in his own control and not in that of others" (Machiavelli 3). Ralph is the best leader on the island because he is very forceful and demanding of the other boys. He made sure they knew he was in charge but at the same time was not too mean to the point where the boys hated him.

Machiavelli decscribes what makes a good leader in his writings. He lists lots of attributes that leaders should have like bravery and compassion. Machiavelli also says "it is necessary for a prince wishing to hold his own to know how to do wrong, and to make use of it". This quote says that a leader needs the ability to do something wrong as long as if it's for the overall good. I think Piggy, from "Lord of the Flies" should be the leader. He thinks logically and knows what to do for the good of everyone.

I agreee with words. A show of power and strength is needed to keep the citizens in check. Especially with young children on a deserted island, their must a organized structure that takes of care of everyone in a way that keep everyone safe. Safety comes before Fun, and Jack really shows these attributes with his defiant stance against the leader Ralph and his careful words that can convince many to follow him.

I want to agree with both of these points. Some people have been saying that fear and hatred go hand in hand but I agree with this point you wrote that "inspiring fear does not earn hatred." Fear just inspires a healthy respect while hatred inspires disrespect for a leader. I also agree with your point that Jack would make the best leader on the island because of his previous experience leading the choir and general knowledge of survival skills.

I don't believe that Jack would make a great leader because it appears that he thinks about himself and his friend's well-being more than the other boys. Ralph is most likely the best option because he chose to step up and take charge.

I completely agree with your statement as a leader should be able to rule from their own will and the will of others. It's also good for the leaders to learn from their own mistakes and use them for themselves and others. I also agree that Piggy should be the leader. The young kids don't realize the danger they are in since they are only around 6-12 years old. And Piggy is the only one that can lead them to safety, but no one will listen to him because of his appearance.

What does Machiavelli argue makes a great leader? On the island, who do you think would make the best leader? Why?

Machiavelli states that a good leader is both feared, to ensure superiority, and selfless. Although feared, a leader can be merciful which allows for the general citizens to respect him. This is what Machiavelli believes makes a good leader as they have a balance between order and admiration. I believe, not one character would make a great leader, however a balance between Ralph's general liking by the majority of kids on the island and Piggy's intelligent decision making would make a great leader on the island. This is displayed in the book itself as many of Piggy's decisions are denied at first but in the end utilised by Ralph to advantage the island.

Machiavelli believes that a leader must be feared rather than loved, and he must also be feared without being hated. In doing so, the leader would gain the respect of his or her citizens, and they would obey the laws with trust in their leader. He must be feared because the people "will have less scruple in offending one who is beloved than one who is feared" (Machiavelli 2). Along with that, he must avoid hate so that the citizens would not try to overthrow the government or the leader. On the island, I believe that Piggy would be the best leader for multiple reasons. Machiavelli mentioned that a good leader must be able to inflict fear upon his people, and Piggy shows that he is capable by yelling at everyone in Chapter two. He also thinks rationally, and despite his physical appearance and issues, he has a good idea on what to prioritize on the island, just like Ralph.

Machiavelli believes that a great leader has many different qualities. For example, he states that a leader must be feared rather hated or loved. He points out that fear maintains order. "In his own control and not that in others; he must endeavor only to avoid hatred". In LOTF, I believe that Ralph is the leader. Even though Piggy's brain and knowledge trounce Ralph's, it is clear that no one is wiling to listen to Piggy. In my opinion, the conch symbolizes power and so since the boys see Ralph with a conch they view him as a leader.

When you say that Piggy and Ralph would rule the island well together, how would they split the leadership? Do you think that eventually, Ralph or Piggy would want to have more power than his co-leader and take the position as leader of the island?

I don't believe Ralph is the best option. Piggy seems to care for the betterment of the group as well as the importance of taking time on decisions. Ralph is more assertive & feared, but Piggy uses his experiences & observations which ultimately helps the group more in the long run.

Machiavelli argues that a good leader is someone who is well respected and supported by his/her own people. On the island, Ralph makes the best leader. He is very mature and is responsible for what has to be done in order to survive on the island. He makes very wise decisions, like when he split up the kids to hunt, build huts, etc. For example, he tells the kids that they "must make a fire" so that "if a ship comes near the island," (Golding 38) it will notice them.

I agree with your statement about how a leader must be feared but not hated. However, I find it arguable that people generally do not pay attention to things they hate. For example, if two warring nations hated each other, they would not ignore each other, in fact, they may pay more attention to each other. Same with politics, many people hate the current president but still closely follow his actions, if only to criticize them.

Machiavelli believes that a great leader must be feared or loved by his people. He should never be hated because hate is a difficult feeling to control. Machiavelli also says that if a prince wishes to prosper, he should "know how to do wrong, and to make use of it or not according to necessity"(Machiavelli Chapter XV pg 1). The leader should be able to twist vice and virtue and should have a good balance between the two in order to satisfy the needs of the people. I think the best leader for the island would be Ralph because he focuses on the long term goals of the boys instead on focusing on temporary victories such as Jack, who only cared about catching a pig. Ralph drove his energy into building a shelter for the boys so that they would have a place to stay for however long they would be stuck on the island. This shows the leadership qualities that Ralph possesses.

I agree that Ralph may not think of the consequences of his decisions and Piggy is a much more realistic person. However, I disagree that Piggy is more fit to be a leader in Lord of the Flies because to the other children, Piggy is weak in both physical capabilities and assertiveness, therefore disrespected by everyone. He would make a good leader if he were feared, because if not, the others see no threat in him and are unafraid of the consequences of not listening to him.

Machiavelli argues that a great leader does whatever that needs to be done to accomplish goals. By our standards, Ralph would be the best leader. He uses proper democratic tactics to become a leader, and does both what he thinks is best and what everybody else thinks is best. He also does what he thinks is best for the group without hurting a specific group. Machiavelli would likely like Jack. He is there to work efficiently, and he doesn't have time to here others out. He would work people without value for their ideas and livelihood. The best leader for the island would be Ralph, because he both pleases the rest of the group and goals they need to meet.

Your argument is very good. I agree with you, because Ralph would and so far is a good leader. Being liked by everyone and being successful is obviously a large part of politics if you even look today.

Machiavelli says that in order to be a great leader, one must "know how to do wrong, and to make use of it," or in other words, learn when the right time to be immoral is. I think this is a very hard thing to achieve because a leader must take into account all the feelings and beliefs of the people he is leading but also must look at the big picture and what's best as a whole. He also says a leader must be intelligent, strong, and be considered kind, not cruel, but not too lenient all at the same time. I think Ralph is the best option for a leader because he considers the practical needs for the boys.

Machiavelli states many things that make a great things. A great leader must "desire to be clement and not cruel" (Machiavelli 1), but must know how to use it in moderation. A leader must also prioritize being loved or being feared. He states that a good leader will prefer being feared, because the cons of being loved over feared greatly outweigh the cons of being feared over loved. "it is much safer to be feared than loved, when, of the two, either must be dispensed with" (Machiavelli 2). Machiavelli also states that a leader must put all citizens needs first in all endeavors, including bad ones. "Therefore a prince, so long as he keeps his subjects united and loyal, ought not to mind the reproach of cruelty" (Machiavelli 1). In Lord of the Flies, the best leader is the Ralph. He is posses the quality to put others needs first and is not very rash with anyone.